As political polarisation grows, so to does violence against MPs |

UN News:
As an MP, tell me about your experiences of political violence.

Valentina Grippo MP, Italy:
 Well, I have my own political experience, and also what I have observed. I am in the PACE, in the Council of Europe delegation, where we can see very different countries, very different situations, but there is a common line between all of them, which is that there is a very high polarization of the public discussion worldwide.

And this gets to a change of pattern in the political discussion. You no more have the confrontation between ideas, which is normal, which is part of politics, but you really have a fight between identities. And this brings a very strong discussion between different points of view, and between the representatives and the public and the citizens.

UN News:
How has that affected the work that you carry out?

Valentina Grippo MP, Italy:
 Well, it makes it more difficult to somehow be able to deliver a message without fearing that it is misunderstood. That leads to levels of discussion that you don’t want. You really want the citizens to understand the core of the problems.

And sometimes you see that this gets to self-censorship of the public discussion, and it is not good, not only for MPs, but for democratic life.

UN News:
 Can you give any specific examples in the last few years?

Valentina Grippo MP, Italy:
 Well, you have different examples. One, of course, is under the eyes of everyone, on the digital world, the kind of attacks on social media, the kind of attacks you can have. And with AI instruments, last year, if you say something that is not perfectly in line with what your audience wants to hear, then you have multiple attacks.

And somehow, of course, they are not pure attacks — it is not only citizens speaking. You see that there is also, somehow, a direction in order to make you be senseless. So it is a big issue.

And then, of course, not all countries are the same. I read a very interesting data in a meeting that we had last year in Strasbourg about how many people in the world are in countries where you have democratic values and liberal values, which is only 25% of the world.

So we always have to remember that there are big parts of the world where discussion is not free, not only for the reason I’m mentioning, but really you cannot say what you think without fearing for your safety. Just think about what’s going on in Iran, with the discussion that we had with some representatives of people that tried to be on the right side and really could not speak anymore.

And so, of course, not all countries experience the same level of attack. In some areas, you really risk your own life. That’s why the responsibility of all the inter-parliamentary unions and global institutions is higher. Those of us that have freedom — I mean, I have attacks if I say something that is not aligned, but it is not the kind of attacks that my colleagues from more dangerous parts of the world have.

UN News:
 So these attacks that you’ve experienced, are they mostly online?

Valentina Grippo MP, Italy:
 My personal ones are mostly online, the personal ones I can talk about. But I have been standing for colleagues in other countries, in Turkey and Azerbaijan, that really had also physical attacks from citizens that were not sharing their views of politics.

UN News:
 Do you think it is harder to be a politician today if you’re in a developing country, for example?

Valentina Grippo MP, Italy:
 Yes. I mean, it is an honour and a responsibility. It is a wonderful job to represent the people. However, it is a tough time, because the role of being in the institution and representing the people is not always recognised by the mass or by the citizens as a useful mission.

And you have all the fake news, disinformation and so on. I am the General Rapporteur for the safety of journalists and for the freedom of information in the Council of Europe, and it is very difficult also to deliver the correct messages on what you are trying to do.

So it is complex. I would not say difficult, because there are more difficult jobs, but it is hard to do it well, and it is hard to do it safely.

UN News:
 A report that came out yesterday said that political violence was rising. I just wanted to ask you — why do you think that is? Why do you think, generally, political violence is rising today?

Valentina Grippo MP, Italy:
 Because I think that the differences that once were on the level of different points of view of the world — so I would say, I am more democratic, one would say I am more liberal — and we would just see what the differences were, have become differences on identities.

And I also think how social media works. You have an algorithm that gives you content that is always homogeneous to what you think. So you live in your micro-world that is all homogeneous, and then you find someone that is completely different, and this brings very strong reactions. It makes it more polarized.

Yes, the polarization is the issue that makes it very difficult to get to a common pattern. Politics is basically finding, at the end of the discussion, a common pattern in order to change the world together. And this is very hard in these times.

UN News:
 You touched briefly on the role of social media in polarizing public debate. In your role as Special Rapporteur for media freedom, what are your thoughts on media contributing to that polarization today?

Valentina Grippo MP, Italy:
 Very, very high. And of course, we have traditional media, we have online information, we have YouTube and all the other peer-to-peer information instruments.

What is important to underline is that it is not only polarization of the discussion that is freely happening, but there are a lot of interests beneath the polarization that push the polarization, that pay for polarizing the discussion. And there are big international influences that work in order to polarize the discussion.

And this brings political violence against parliamentarians also higher. I mean, we have seen it in the Russian aggression of Ukraine. I was in Berlin analysing all the instruments of information that were coming out, and half of them were just deep fake news generated in order to influence public opinion of other countries across Europe that should decide whether to support Ukraine or not.

So it is not only a public discussion issue. It is something that really interferes with international politics.

UN News:
 It must be really hard to be a politician and parliamentarian today. Many younger generations see this pressure and the violence committed against parliamentarians. What advice would you give to young people thinking about a career in politics and becoming a member of parliament like yourself?

Valentina Grippo MP, Italy:
 Well, I think it is very important. We have just done a statement at the Council of Europe trying to lower the voting age in most European countries to 16. I really believe that the role of the youngest is vital.

It is not that young people are not interested in politics. If you intend politics as changing the world, they are very interested in being active. But when you ask them to transfer this interest into being active inside the institution, then this lowers very much, for the reasons that you were mentioning.

So I really insist that they should be active starting from their local administration. You do not need to be at the highest level from the beginning. I think it is very important for young people, because you learn a lot being inside institutions, and for the institutions because we need people that are digital natives and already know how to move inside this hostile and complex world from the beginning.

But I understand that someone can choose to change the world in another way, because it is tough. It is not easy.

UN News:
 Just one final question. We have spoken about these challenges. How would you approach solutions, and what solutions are there to combat this rise, particularly through organisations like the IPU?

Valentina Grippo MP, Italy:
 What is really important — these years are vital. We have been used since the last century to a very important role of multilateral global organisations that would somehow be the arbiter, those that would speak in front of huge events. I mean, we had the pandemic phase, and now we have wars worldwide. We would have someone who could rule the world somehow.

We are no more in that phase. We are at the beginning of a completely new phase. So I believe that we had a phase in Italy, but everywhere, where we started to think that maybe the 20th-century model of a stronger state was more attractive. Now I believe it is the moment that all the democracies of the world and all those that share democratic values stand together in order to defend these values.

UN News:
As a woman in politics, the amount of violence experienced by women is noticeably higher than men. What challenges and experiences have you seen?

Valentina Grippo MP, Italy:
 Two years ago I presented a law on attacks against women journalists online, which is very close to what we are discussing today.

In general, you have, let’s say, an algebraic multiplier. You are a public figure and you are attacked. Then you are a woman, and you are more attacked. And these are multipliers.

And it is a very delicate phase also for women’s rights worldwide. We had very important years in achieving rights that were established ten years ago. I have a 23-year-old daughter, and I see that some rights that for me were acquired are not so much achieved anymore at the moment.

And also, for a woman, being free to say what you think is much more difficult. And again, not only in order to defend her rights to speak, but also in order to defend the public’s right to be informed by that woman — that journalist, that MP.

So I think it is something we have to stand together for, because it is not only a question of defending democratic values, but a question of where our society is going.